I'm a fool!

peacefulpaul · 03-31-2006, 07:46 AM

Ok - So I'm at a table in a 5 table SNG. I have a little under 2k in chips (about the average, maybe a little less) and the blinds are 15/30. I've been very tight as I'm surrounded by loose players and calling stations. I get dealt k-10 in middle position and, because I think it's about time I win a pot, I make a 5x the bb raise (the only way of thinning the field.) Everyone folds round to the limper to the left of me who calls, and I take the pot away from them on the turn. The VERY NEXT HAND I'm dealt Kings. I make the same raise, this time the person on the button re-raises, and BEHIND THEM the big blind (who is also a big chip leader) re-raises them. This gets me concerned, but not too concerned, as they could be bullying. I make another small raise (which would have left me with about 1k in chips). The first re-raiser (button Jim as we shall now call him) flat calls my re-re-re-raise, but Big Stack Stan over there re-raises again, by a nice little tempting amount.

It's worth pointing out, for the sake of clarity at this point that about THIRTY MINUTES EARLIER I'd been reading Phil Gordon's little green poker book, wherein he describes almost this exact scenario and points out how the big blinds action mean that HE'S DEFINITELY HOLDING ACES! Of course, I'm thinking, well, he's definitely got aces. I've still got 1000 chips, he's definitely gonna get called by Button Jim, who doesn't know any better, so worst case scenario I can fold and find out that he's holding jacks and just doesn't know how to play... But of course I re-raised all in and he had aces. I think that might be the worst play I've ever made, and I'm never doing it again! (BTW, to further add to the proof that I knew where I was at, Button Jim had the powerhouse of a-8 diamonds and called with it!)

(whilst typing this I've just doubled up in the next tournament holding kings, which makes me feel a little better.)

PapaHun · 03-31-2006, 07:51 AM

In reply to Phil Gordon and the above hand, let me paraphrase Dan Harrington from HoH;

"Whenever somebody tells me he through some intricate reasoning deducted his opponent had aces and laid down his kings pre-flop, I silently think to myself - idiot"...

Don't fold kings pre-flop. Nobody is that good.

HemoGlobin · 03-31-2006, 07:59 AM

when i have pocket kings i usually get beat by a single ace...lol

PapaHun · 03-31-2006, 08:03 AM

Yeah if you by usually mean 30% of the time

equity (%) win (%) tie (%)
Hand 1: 70.2647 % 70.05% 00.22% { KK }
Hand 2: 29.7353 % 29.52% 00.22% { A2s+, A2o+ }

peacefulpaul · 03-31-2006, 08:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PapaHun

In reply to Phil Gordon and the above hand, let me paraphrase Dan Harrington from HoH;

"Whenever somebody tells me he through some intricate reasoning deducted his opponent had aces and laid down his kings pre-flop, I silently think to myself - idiot"...

Don't fold kings pre-flop. Nobody is that good.

I know what you're saying, and broadly speaking I agree. The point is, I've never really been more sure of anything at a poker table than that the chap had aces and I should have walked away...

tomonbass · 03-31-2006, 08:14 AM

You should never fold your Kings in fear of Aces it doesnt happen often enough....

When your dealt kings you just have to persume you are holding the best hand preflop... to many times I see people pulling that crap with QQ JJ AK even AQ etc

Unless you have a tremendous read on an opponent it is very very rare that you should be able to fold the cowboys pre flop .....

peacefulpaul · 03-31-2006, 08:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tomonbass

You should never fold your Kings in fear of Aces it doesnt happen often enough....

When your dealt kings you just have to persume you are holding the best hand preflop... to many times I see people pulling that crap with QQ JJ AK even AQ etc

Unless you have a tremendous read on an opponent it is very very rare that you should be able to fold the cowboys pre flop .....

Well, that makes me feel a bit better...

Arjonius · 04-01-2006, 05:57 PM

I agree with Tomonbass. Since the odds of running into AA are pretty small, it would take a very strong read for me to lay down KK. A consideration would be the kind of shape I'd be in after folding. A little below half of average isn't too bad since the blinds are still low. But frankly, I can only think of a few players who play tight enough that I'd even consider folding.

Trap_Play · 04-12-2006, 10:31 AM

well ive been victim of the kings vs aces battle many times,and if i had it to do all over again,i wouldnt change a thing,unless i have a great read on my opp,i stick to my guns and ride my kings out,beleive it or not ive won my fair share of kings vs aces battles,by catching a straight,or makeing my set of kings.Play them see where the chips fall imo

bettybet · 04-22-2006, 10:30 PM

But tell me this , Why do players think that one A is better then any Pocket pair. A2 A3 A5. You know I have lost with KK many times to crap like that because they hit that A. and me nada